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Question DetailsAsked on 7/22/2014

Should soffit and fascia be replaced after gutters?

I have gutters, fascia and soffit being replaced on my home. The gutters have been replaced, but the soffit and fascia have not. I called the company I've contracted to do the work, and was told that it's actually better to replace the gutters first, and they'll come back and do the soffit/fascia later. This seems to go against what I've read online. Does anyone agree with what they're telling me?

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12 Answers

Voted Best Answer
1
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I don't buy it - the gutters are mounted to and right in front of the fascia - this is a BIG red flag to me - have you paid them a significant amount in advance - sounds to me like they might have put up the gutters and taken off on you.



The gutters will have to be taken back off (including brackets) to either replace fascia or put fascia trim on, so sounds like they do not know what they are doing, or are scamming you.



If you do not get a straight answer out of them (like they fired the guy who put up the gutters first) I would be looking at cancelling your payment (if not too late) and trying to get out of the contract on the ground of incompetence.

Answered 3 years ago by LCD

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Thank you for your response. This place has an A rating on Angie's List and tons of reviews. I think because my house is not fancy they are using their worst workers and telling me lies. I'm going to ask them to send me some information from a reliable source that the gutters should be replaced before the soffit and fascia. They did the work while I wasn't home today, so I was unable to question it while in progress.

Answered 3 years ago by Guest_9244223

1
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Having 30+ years in the roofing and gutter business, I guess I have been doing it all wrong for all this time if what they are telling you is true. The short answer is they must be untruthful about a lot more than just this if they actually think that someone would actually believe that story. I have heard several supposed "qualified contractors" tell people that the metal drip edge is supposed to go behind the gutter when in fact it goes inside the gutter. However, I have never heard that you install gutters to only pull them right back off to do the fascia and soffit. That's so over the top it makes me wonder and worry to the point I am afraid to ask if they have done any other work for you prior to this. I would talk to the highest person possible if you can't get a hold of the owner immediatly and don't let them do ANY more work until you do. It would be interesting to see what he had to say. If he agrees with what you have been told, try to involve a building inspector in your city if at all possible, especially if permits and inspections are required for that type of work in your city.

Source: 30+ years in the business

Answered 3 years ago by Roofman1

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All the above answers are spot on! The only reason I am adding an another answer is to explain why gutters go on last to help with your complaint to the company.

The reason the facia goes on first is to insure that if the gutter should ever over flow the water will not damage the wood subfacia just as the answer says with the drip edge on the roofshould overlap the gutter. If you think of a ducks feathers it is a good example. It sounds like the contractor had work flow problem and the gutter guys had nothing to do and the siding guys were behind on there other project!

I don't think you will find anyone here that would agree with the story they are giving you and you should hold back any money not paid to them untill they do the job correctly.


Don

Answered 3 years ago by ContractorDon

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I certainly hope you are paying a fixed lump sum price for this, not by the hour.

Answered 3 years ago by LCD

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This is not an answer, but an update. I'm not sure how posting questions on this site actually works. Is this a completely BS explanation? :


As for the process as a whole it is actually better to install the gutters before the fascia but it isn’t pertinent to the entire process. We do a lot of soffit and fascia where the gutters are not being replaced. The problem with installing the fascia beforehand is making sure the aluminum fascia trim does not extend to high up on the fascia board. When this happens the nails from the gutter hangers penetrate the aluminum fascia causing it to ripple. It’s best to have the new gutters in place and then the aluminum fascia trim extends up to the hanger nails. I have included a picture showing the whole process for reference – the blue is the new fascia.

Answered 3 years ago by Guest_9244223

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You did the response/addition exactly right.


Guest 9244223 - yeah, sounds like total BS to me all right. Sounds like you are the victim of a shoddy contractor.


1) as I understand it you are having the fascia board REPLACED, and they put the gutter on first - getthem to explain if they will how they are going to replace the fascia board with the gutters already in place, especially as every modern residential gutter system I have seen mounts to the fascia board, or off the bottom of the rafters so it would be impossible to remove the fascia board without removing the mounting brackets.


2) putting the gutters on first and then slipping the fascia trim (metal facing I presume you mean) up behind it is just plain sloppy workmanship - they sure would not have lasted on any of my jobs. They are leaving the top portion of the face of the fascia board and the entire top of it bare and exposed, the part that gets the most splash - unprotected, plus leaving a gap behind the trim (the exposed top edge) where splash water or gutter overflow can go down in that small gap and rot the fascia board, probably faster than if there was no fascia trim on it at all. Also, I fail to see how they can fasten the top of the trim with that method, because it is in behind the gutter - sounds like it is just a slipped-in piece of sheet metal, presumably fastened at the bottom only ?


3) I wonder if they are one of the contractors who incorrectly says the drip edge along the edge of the roof should drain behind the gutter instead of into it as well ?


Based on what you said, unless they can show something to the contrary maybe with photos, their method gets an F in my book. BTW - your picture did not come through, at least on what I see.

Answered 3 years ago by LCD

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Okay, correction. We are not having the fascia _boards_ replaced. (My main need was the new soffit, since had no venting on it.) The contract states aluminum fascia will be installed over all the existing fascia boards. Here is the photo they sent. The blue post-it part is what he states is going to be the new fascia.



Thank you again for your advice. We don't want to fork over the insane amount we'd have to pay in order to sell this house, so we're trying to make it better, but we don't want to have work done incorrectly and then end up paying even more in the end.

Answered 3 years ago by Guest_9244223

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Your pictures did not show up on my end but I have an idea as to what they are.

As all have stated as replies the new fascia aluminum should go all the way up to the bottom edge of the roof. I have never had a problem with the aluminum getting ripples when the gutters were installed after the fascia.

There is only one way I would accept this installation, if the soffits and fascia are done first there is no way to have the aluminum extend all the way to the bottom of the roof decking so I would insist they add a filler strip between the roof sheating and new fascia that overlaps the new fascia they are installing.

I have no idea how long a run the gutters are but there will be exposed wood subfascia exposed which will certainly allow rotting and the possibility of even having water run down behind it and even across the soffits and entering your wall.

It really seems like they have a scheduling problem and the gutters guys were available first. I would even be concerned about possible damage to your new gutters since to install the soffit and fascia later will require ladders to be placed against your nice new gutters! It seems to me that this is an outfit that uses subcontractors and the one crew was tied up on another job. Many contractors use gutter companies now because they can install the gutters for close to what I buy it for.


Don

Answered 3 years ago by ContractorDon

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OK - thanks for the clarification on the fascia wood not being replaced. And your new photo post came through, at least for me.


Photo does not change my opinion, and Don is probably right about the gutter guy being available before the fascia guy. You can clearly see in the photo that any water running down the underlayment (the black tarpaper drooping off the roof - the bottom layer) will run over exposed fascia wood and then BEHIND the metal fasia, rotting the wood behind and eventually the soffits and rafters too.


I am not sure what the white layer is supposed to be, but there is no way they are getting that up under existing shingles and water shield (the glossy black layer under the shingles) without cutting or pulling shingle nails, or pulling up a lot of shingles - which will shorten their life or leave them unsecured.


Plus the fascia metal will be unfastened except at the bottom, so it will not be tight up against the fascia wood or tight up under the shingles like it should be.


The dimples in the fascia I have seen, especially in thinaluminum fascia material - takes a touch more work, but easy to predrill the fascia so the mounting bracket screws do not twist and bunch up the metal as they go through. I hit the hole with some caulk before putting the screw in so the screwhole is sealed against water infiltration - some higher-end bracket types have gasketing on the mating surface to seal the fastener hole through the fascia.


My take on it - still at best a D grade on installation method - at least they understand some of the concepts of actually getting the water into the gutter with the white layer, but the way they have that it looks like a piece of underlayment, not drip edge as it should be, and leaves large gap at top of metal fascia cover. So - my opinion is unchanged - the gutters should come off, the fascia front be completely covered with the metal fascia cover, then the gutter put back on.


As an aside - I am sorry to see you are putting on gutter covers (if the photo shows what you are actually having done). In my opinion, not only a waste of money but a good way to pretty much assure accelerated decay of the edge of the shingles and roofing, because they cause decaying organic material to lay right at the roof edge rather than being washed away down the downspouts or at worst laying in the bottom of the gutter, harmless till hosed away every year or two.


In my opinion, gutter covers are one of the worst andmost wasteful home "improvement" scams, along with sealing brick exteriors, water-based driveway sealers, and interior exposed basement drainage systems.

Answered 3 years ago by LCD

1
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Your picture shows up now. I must have answered your post too quickly, pictures may take a bit longer to post and I think I answered yours almost as you wrote it.

There are multiple problems with this install if done the way the picture shows as LCD said. Number one this display in a showroom does not show how what I bet your home roof edge looks like. Odds are the sheathing extends past the woden fascia so the ice shield could not wrap around and onto the fascia. And as LCD said I bet they are not installing the white drip edge shown in the picture and if they do it will not look like this since there is no way to install it in this manner as LCD pointed out. The ice shield shown unless they are putting a new roof on is also impossible to install on an existing roof plus must be covered by either roofing or sheet metal as it will not hold up to exposure to sunlight. It is not a finished roof surface and must be covered!

Leaf guards are as LCD said just asking for trouble in most homes, you are better off having a gutter cleaning service clean them on a regular basis. Unless you want to go into the topsoil business because that is what will fill up your gutters. Also you said something about selling this home so why waste the money on them as they are not a requirement for the sale of a house.


Don

Answered 3 years ago by ContractorDon

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Thanks again LCD and Don. I appreciate the time you've taken to explain the process and make me feel justified in arguing their installation procedure.


We have complained enough that someone is coming out to look at the gutters tomorrow. (Soffit and fascia have still not been replaced.) The new gutters were nailed onto the existing aluminum fascia, so they can't even remove that until the gutters re removed. We will require that the gutters actually be nailed to the aluminum, and work to terminate the contract if they fail to do the installation correctly. At this point, I think I will require a second opinion on the installation from someone not affiliated with their company if I am going to pay them for this work.


And no, we are not getting any gutter covers/leaft guards. That was the sample they used for the photo, but we are getting traditional, uncovered gutters.

Answered 3 years ago by Guest_9244223

0
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Good luck and glad we possibly could help.


Don

Answered 3 years ago by ContractorDon




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